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Rock Defender [54] TigerPulse: 90% Posts: 35 Joined: 11/30/98 |
Sep 2, 2011, 4:34 PM | |
For you folks that think it's recruiting that wins, simply look at VT, TCU, Boise, and other such programs as proof that coaching is what creates stability and success. That then brings exposure which boosts recruiting and the combination of better talent and coaching propels you to the next level. Miami, FSU, Bama and other top programs always have great talent, but struggle when the right coaching is not in place. There are exceptions, but in the chicken & egg debate of talent versus coaching, coaching is by far the more important factor in success. You take the past 20 recruiting classes for Boise, VT, and TCU and I bet not one of them has had 7 or more years where their recruiting class outranked Clemson. I'd bet you can count on one hand the times TCU or Boise out recruited Clemson. And none of those programs have the advantages Clemson does either, which further enhances the superior job their coaches have done. |
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 | All-In [31217] TigerPulse: 100% Posts: 34720 Joined: 6/22/03 | VT recruits well. TCU and BSU.. no matter how
Sep 2, 2011, 4:43 PM | |
many time sit has to be said.. DO NOT play in a AQ conference. IF they did, maybe they would be better.. maybe they would do worse.I disagree with your "chicken and egg" assessment and your limited analogy. Not to take away anything from the fine coaching job that TCU, BSU, and VT have done. Those guys deserve their props. |
| | Geville Tiger on Clemson football , "Dabo's only problem is he has to deal with turd fans questioning every move he makes.” |
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| Rock Defender [54] TigerPulse: 90% Posts: 35 Joined: 11/30/98 | VT rarely out recruits Clemson, and TCU beat us with a team
Sep 2, 2011, 7:57 PM | |
full of recruits ranked lower than ours. Boise has been consistently beating the big boys when given the opportunity, which is all that matters. They beat VT last year, when did we last do that?As far as your opinion of what you see as my opinion and analogy, you're wrong. What I stated is FACT. Not opinion. Anyone can cherry pick certain schools, teams, years that are exceptions. The reality, however, is totally different. No school wins consistently based purely on talent. None! FSU, Miami, Bama, and others always have great talent, but their fortunes on the field are directly tied to the coaching staff. Schools like VT, Boise, TCU, etc. didn't win until the right coach was in place. Recruiting improved AFTER they started winning consistently. In an odd twist, Red Parker was a great recruiter, but terrible coach. Sound familiar? We sucked under Red, but Pell & Ford left VT to come to Clemson and went 11-1 and almost won a national championship in only their 2nd year. Good coaches win regardless of talent, average coaches will never win consistently no matter how much talent they have. And that has been proven in every sport at every level. If you can prove I'm wrong, do it, give the evidence. |
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| CU Guru [1799] TigerPulse: 30% Posts: 2999 Joined: 4/2/08 | Careful, as noted before, This board is not fond of facts
Sep 2, 2011, 4:56 PM | |
that make sense. Unless of course it's saying that everything is fine and dandy. |
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| All-TigerNet [14921] TigerPulse: 100% Posts: 12314 Joined: 3/28/06 | neither is Blue Caddy***
Sep 2, 2011, 5:10 PM | | | |
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| Rock Defender [54] TigerPulse: 90% Posts: 35 Joined: 11/30/98 | I posted the facts, as always. Flaming and attacking me does
Sep 2, 2011, 7:59 PM | |
not make me wrong. It just proves those folks denial. |
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| Addict [444] TigerPulse: 100% Posts: 126 Joined: 2/26/09 | TCU fan here
Sep 2, 2011, 5:14 PM [ in reply to Careful, as noted before, This board is not fond of facts ] | |
Gary Patterson recruits kids wh want to over achieve and then pushes them to do so both on and off the field. A recruit will not be allowed to coast his way through. After TCU won the Rose Bowl and finsihed second in the nation ther is not a home Coach p can not go in now and talk with a recruit and his family and the recruiting looks t be getting better and better. Starting in 2012 TCU will play in the Big East which also helps recruiting. In the past other Texas schools that recruited against TCU told recruits that if you go to TCU you can't play in a bcs bowl but now TCU has played in two and thats more than a lot of the other Texas schools can say. |
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| CU Medallion [59347] TigerPulse: 100% Posts: 46770 Joined: 4/23/00 | Patterson has done an outstanding job.***
Sep 2, 2011, 6:23 PM | | | |
| | "Democracy is the theory that the common people know what they want, and deserve to get it good and hard."
- H. L. Mencken |
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| Rock Defender [54] TigerPulse: 90% Posts: 35 Joined: 11/30/98 | All true, but you would agree the great coaching is why TCU
Sep 2, 2011, 7:34 PM [ in reply to TCU fan here ] | |
has turned into a top 20 program, yes? The doors you spoke of were closed until TCU won, which means this staff won with what the previous staff had, and like VT, got kids they wanted, not 4 & 5 star recruits. Recruiting got better only AFTER the consistent winning. |
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| CU Medallion [59347] TigerPulse: 100% Posts: 46770 Joined: 4/23/00 | So ultimately, this is another post about Clemson's
Sep 2, 2011, 5:09 PM | |
shortcomings. I think I'm seeing a trend. |
| | "Democracy is the theory that the common people know what they want, and deserve to get it good and hard."
- H. L. Mencken |
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| All-In [31217] TigerPulse: 100% Posts: 34720 Joined: 6/22/03 | no. it's another wookie defense.. 2+2 = 4 and there are 4
Sep 2, 2011, 5:22 PM | |
4 letters in blue. Those are facts , so clearly blue is the best color.amandad77 "yup.. cant argue with facts" |
| | Geville Tiger on Clemson football , "Dabo's only problem is he has to deal with turd fans questioning every move he makes.” |
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| Rock Defender [54] TigerPulse: 90% Posts: 35 Joined: 11/30/98 | Like great reporters I dont make the news I simply report it***
Sep 2, 2011, 8:01 PM [ in reply to So ultimately, this is another post about Clemson's ] | | | |
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| All-In [49557] TigerPulse: 100% Posts: 21662 Joined: 12/22/98 | You are neither a reporter nor great.***
Sep 2, 2011, 10:20 PM | | | |
| | MauldinT, where are you??? |
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| Rock Defender [54] TigerPulse: 90% Posts: 35 Joined: 11/30/98 | never said i was. typical stupid lack of reading comp reply***
Sep 3, 2011, 9:58 PM | | | |
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| All-Conference [430] TigerPulse: 92% Posts: 734 Joined: 9/25/03 | There's a game tomorrow, why not just say Go Tigers and
Sep 2, 2011, 5:39 PM | |
get behind this team. Give them a chance. The season hasn't even started yet. Or maybe just go pull for these great coaches you are talking about. |
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| Rock Defender [54] TigerPulse: 90% Posts: 35 Joined: 11/30/98 | Like most objective & rational folks I can support something
Sep 2, 2011, 8:12 PM | |
and be point out the obvious flaws at the same time. Why can't pumpers be rational & objective? Great coaches, executives, & leaders focus almost completely on improving by spending very little time patting players and their staff on the back. Instead they obsess over every error and negative detail. |
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| All-Conference [430] TigerPulse: 92% Posts: 734 Joined: 9/25/03 | It's just that I rarely hear you say anything positive about
Sep 2, 2011, 8:49 PM | |
the team.I guess I see this as a game and not such as serious thing. Of course I want to win. But right now I'm excited about the game tomorrow, I'm not thinking about all the issues we may have. I'm thinking about getting back up to the place I love, enjoying tailgating with my family, watching the team run down the hill, all those good things. I disagree that all great leaders spend very little time encouraging those they lead. I disagree that they spend very little time telling people they do a good job. There are different styles of leadership, not sure one is right all the time. So focusing on the negative, the mistakes could be one style of leadership. Focusing also on the positive is another. I know you didn't say they spend no time patting people on the back. I'm just looking at the season with optimism and excitement. I may be wrong. But I'll still be excited every game. I know that's just me and you may think that is crazy. |
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| Orange Blooded [4995] TigerPulse: 59% Posts: 8298 Joined: 10/8/08 | Re: Boise State & TCU ...............
Sep 2, 2011, 8:59 PM | |
And what happens when VT goes up against a team of better talent? They run through the ACC every year, but cant win the big game. Why? Because talent is the most important thing. Look at the recruiting rankings. Every year teams like Bama, Florida, USC, and Texas are at the top of the rankings, and they're the teams competing for national titles year in and year out. |
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| Oculus Spirit [92373] TigerPulse: 100% Posts: 45884 Joined: 10/18/09 | OK, takes talent & coaching,..about evenly, but we've lacked
Sep 2, 2011, 9:45 PM | |
great coaching many years, and our boys have suffered.Go TIGERS! |
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